Theel-RufaiTVCinterview: “WewillworkuntilTinubu, otherAPCcandidateswin”

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Twomenandtwo visionsforthefuture!

Honestly,itwasnotverydifficultto get that done. First of all, right from 2019 after President Muhammadu Buhari won the election, some of us privately approached him and askedforhissuccessionplans.Inoneofour meetings I had with Mr President, he told methathehasnosuccessionplan. Then,I told him that he must be interested in his successor He insisted that the democratic process will produce his successor But I reasoned otherwise and I said to him that things don't work that way I told him that he must have a legacy and he should be interested in who will preserve those legacies. Then,hesaidtomethatitwasa brilliantideaandthathewouldthinkabout it.Till2020,Buharididnothaveaposition.

In2020,Iaskedhimwherehewouldwant hissuccessortobefrom. Isaidtohimthat he did not have to anoint anyone, since he believes in the democratic process I continued to engage him till a point he askedwhyIwasmuchconcernedabouthis successor Then, he said to me, Nasir, going by our arrangement, my successor must be from the South. I said, thank you, Mr President. I asked him if I could go public with that and he granted that permission. People will recall that late in 2019orearly2020,Iwasthefirstgovernor tocomeoutandsaythatthenextpresident ofNigeriamustbefromtheSouth.

To be fair to Mr President, he has been consistent in private conversations with some of us on this. So, it was not very difficult for those of us in the ,APC particularly the Northern governors to say thisisthePresident'sposition.

But why was the intense intra-party heat before your candidate eventually emerged?

What happened was that all kinds of political games that took control of the party began in a way to achieve a predeterminedconclusionthatwasnotvery cleartousatthetime. Butoneofthethings wepushedwasforthePresidenttodeclare whohewantedasthechairmanoftheparty I remember the Progressive Governors Forumatatimemandatedmewiththetask toseekaudiencewithMr Presidentonwho hewantedasthechairmanofourparty

Again, the President first said all chairmanshipaspirantsshouldcomeoutto seek votes from the delegates. But, we insisted that he should tell us who he wantedandwewillallsupporthim. Then, hesaidthechairmanshouldbefromNorthcentral and finally, he nominated Senator AbdullahiAdamu.We agreed. Once that decision was taken, it was a very clear signal that the next presidential candidate of our party will be from the South. Then, weswappedpositionsofpartyexecutives.

Havingestablishedthepositionoftheparty chairman, who is from the North, it was simplylogicalforusthatthenextpresident must be from the South and we were all looking at how to minimise competition within the party to pick a Southern candidate.

We also heard that some members of the

WorkingCommitteecalledusandsaidthe Senate President was the anointed one. Then, the northern governors sought audience with Mr President over that rumourandthisisnotconsistentwithwhat you have been telling us in the past two to threeyears. ThePresidentexpressedshock andsaidhewasnotpartofthegame.Right thereandthen,hesummonedGarbaShehu toissueastatementthathehadnotanointed anyone.

But, we learnt that at some point, the President preferred a Northern candidate?

We also heard the same and it was of concern to us when some governors and someseniormembersofthepartybeganto get calls from some elements in the Villa nudging them to buy forms to contest for presidency That began to worry us. So, someofuswentbacktothePresidenttoask whatwasgoingon. ThePresidentsaidhis position had not changed But, it was worrisome that there were some senior membersoftheparty,believeitornot,that wanted another northerner to succeed PresidentBuhari.

Howdidyouhandlethesituationthen?

We,theAPCgovernorsfromtheNorth,had to sit down, reviewed the situation and consideredwhat our forefatherswould do. We are Northerners. We are people of honour Wekeepourwords.Werespondto kindnesswithkindness.Thisisthepolitical culture in the North.This is whatAhmadu Bello, Sardauna of Sokoto, practised.This is what Tafawa Balewa practised. This is whatAminuKanopractised.

We talked to ourselves that we would not allow any other agenda to produce the presidentialcandidatefromtheNorth.And all of us, including Governor Badru of Jigawa who was encouraged by those elements in the Villa to buy form, made a decisionthatthepresidencymustgoSouth. We, therefore, sent a delegation to the Presidenttoinformhimaboutourdecision andwemadeourdecisionpublic.Thatwas thesecondstep.

Now among the Southerners, we had a challengewhetherweshouldcomeupwith a consensus or we all go to the primaries. This was because some of us supported Amaechi; some supported Osinbajo; some supported Asiwaju; and some supported Kayode Fayemi. Again, we had to have anotherroundofdiscussions.Ofcourse,all of us could not come to an agreement because one of us, Yahaya Bello, was runningtoo.Andhesaidhewasnotgoing tostepdown.

But still, the momentum was from the Northwest The Northwest governors, along with Senator Wammako met, and after several meetings of going back and forth, we decided that we will go with Asiwaju Bola Ahmed Tinubu Then, NortheastfollowedandNorth-Central,toa large extent also followed. That was why we went to the convention quite confident thatAsiwajuwillhavethenumbersandthe momentum.We were even shocked by the margin with which he won. It was clear that it was not just the Northern APC governors that supported him, but Tinubu had support across the country And he emergedasthecandidateoverwhelmingly

We also learnt that some of the governors are withdrawing their support from Tinubu. Whatisthesituation?

Iwanttoassureyouthataswespeaktoday, all the 22APC governors, including those that contested for the presidency, are solidly behind our presidential candidate, Asiwaju Bola Ahmed Tinubu, and we are doing everything we can to ensure that he succeeds.ButforusasNortherngovernors, itwasamatterofhonour;itwasamatterof just doing what is right; it was a matter of doingwhatisfair

How then did you handle the issue of manyaspirantscomingfromtheSouth?

The President told us to go and give him five aspirants from the South and he will pick one. We, the Progressive governors wentback,metandcameupwiththenames ofVicePresidentOsinabajo,AsiwajuBola Ahmed Tinubu, Gov Rotimi Amaechi, Gov Dave Umahi and Gov Kayode Fayemi. Wetookthesefivenamesandsaid tohimthatwebelievedanyoneofthemcan be a veritable successor and they can preservehislegacy

We said they have been either past or serving governors and they know how to handle state and institutions and we can work with them “Pick any one Mr Presidentandwewillsupportyourchoice. Then, most of us had our preferences but wesaidwewilldefertohimbecauseofthe loveandrespectforhim.”

Please, don't doubt this. All of us have great respect for the President because we knowhisheartandweknowhisintention. Heisamanofintegritywhohasgreatand good intentions all the time. He could be misled,heishuman,though. Mr President said the five names were good choices, relationship with the President and I can alwaysgotohimtoask. ThisiswhyIam theenemyofmostofthemalongwithsome ofus.

With these elements in the Villa, don't you thinktheyshouldbeunmaskednow?

Unmasking them is not as joyful as defeatingthem.They'llbeunmaskedindue time. But we have defeated them when they wanted their own people in the national working committee of the party We have defeated them when they wanted their anointed candidate to be the presidential candidate of the party without dueregardtodueprocessandevenrespect us as governors Governors have been touted to be corrupt; governors are said to be bad and we didn't matter to them Meanwhilenoneofthemhascontestedfor governorshiporevencouncillorshipandif theydid,theywouldnotwin.

We will get to the unmasking stage. The stage we are now is to come to Nigerians anddrawtheirattentiontothefactthatthere are elements that are doing this and they don'tmeanwellforourparty Theywantto incite voters against our party so that we lose election. Once Nigerians know that, then, they will know where these funny decisionsarecomingfrom.

And once the election is done and settled, bythegraceofGodinourfavourinthenext three weeks, the process of unmasking themcanstart. Wearenotsleeping. Weare goingtoworkhardtillFebruary27whenall the election results would have come out and by the grace of God when Asiwaju would have been elected and other APC candidateswouldhavebeenelected. The presidential candidate of the Peoples' Democratic Party has said that the CBN should not extend its policy on cash swap.

President. Now, with the extension of 10 days, he is turning round to say that the CBN should not extend means something. It shows clearly that he is benefiting from thepainNigeriansaregoingthroughatthe moment.IhaveseenprotestinLagostoday I have reports of people in Kaduna that usingthenameofBuhari.

Some have insinuated that there is no cordial relationship between your presidential candidate and the President. What'sgoingon?

Hewillstillgotoothercampaigns,though you need to understand that his primary having worked with them and any one of themcanbePresident. Hesaidnow,weput himinaquagmire. Butwetoldhimtoclose hiseyesandpickone.

He said no. Then, the President said they are all my brothers or children, therefore, let the democratic process produce the winner and that was how we went to the primaries. Yes, some elements wanted to force a consensus around one person, but the President insisted that the democratic processmustprevail.

Since the President had already concluded that the democratic process should prevail, was there subtle influence fromAsoRockduringthistime?

Yes, there were. Those elements in the Villaweretheonesthatwantedaparticular candidateandtheydidn'thavethecourtesy tocallusasgovernorstoinformussothat wecouldhavediscussionsonthematteror evengiveourviews,butthatdidn'tmatter It was convenient to hide behind the President's name and say this, as if we cannotgotothePresidenttoaskhim. And thisistheirmodusoperandi.Peoplelikeme who can go to the President to ask him aboutanyrumourcomingfromtheVillais the most hated because I have that

Whatisyourtake?

Ifyoulookatthestatementfromtheother partyafterIspokeonthecashswap,weare notagainstthepolicy Cashlessistheway togo.Wehavenoproblemwithit,butyou don'tdoitinafewweeks. Allowtimefor every farmer, trader, student, market women in the villages to be able to take their money to the bank and get new currency or go and meet them where they are doing their business, take the bullion vanswithsecuritytothemandchangetheir moneyforthemwithease.POSwon'twork in some places where there is network challenge. Letussitdownandlookatthis thingandgiveareasonabletimetodothis thing.

Even the CBN Act that empowers the President to issue a directive on currency redesignsaysthatreasonabletimemustbe given before a currency ceases to be legal tender Arefewweeksareasonabletime? So,what'syourtakeonAtiku'sreaction?

The fact that the Presidential candidate of the PDP, who last week issued statement appealingforextensionbecausehewanted togetsympathynowturningaroundtosing anothersongspeaksvolume. Hewantedto comeouttospeakagainstourpartyandthe cannot buy food; they cannot sell because there is no cash, and yet, the PDP's presidential candidate says don't extend becauseheisgainingfromit.

The incitement of the people against the governmentofAPCisagaintohim. This incitement is stronger in the North where Atiku hopes to benefit from. Secondly, we should know that the presidential candidates of the other parties, like the NNPP,havestrongrelationshipswithsome banksandevenownsome.Theycangetthe currencywhilewecan't.

IwantNigerianstounderstandveryclearly that it is unfortunate that somebody who advocated for extension last week is now saying don't extend. If he has the poor at heart, the farmers, the market women and men,thevillagers,hewon'tsaythat.

He has said the policy will tame votebuying.Isthiscorrect?

IfAtikuAbubarkaoranybodyissayingthat ifyouextend,therewillbevote-buying.Is Nairatheonlycurrencywithwhichyoucan buyvotes?YoucangoacrosstoNigerand buycefaifthedollaristoobig. Andafter elections,cefacanbeconvertedintoNaira. Thatisnotthesolutiontovote-buying.

Some have accused the President of not supporting your candidate as he has not been attending your party's presidential ralliesinrecenttimes. Isthattrue?

It is not true that President Buhari is not attendingourrallies. Thefirstmajorrallies we had in Jos, Plateau, Buhari was there, and spoke very well. And said Asiwaju Bola Ahmed Tinubu is his Khalifah, meaningtheonecomingafterhim. The next place was in Kano but the Presidentwasnotthere.WhenImethim,I asked why, he said, he was not invited; he wasnotscheduled.Thatwaswhenwehad to schedule him forAdamawa, Yobe… In Adamawa, he raised Asiwaju's hands up and said this is my successor, this is my Khalifahandyou'reluckyasapartytohave him as the party's candidate judging from thegreatthingshedidinLagos.Hesaidthe samethinginYobe.

HewassupposedtobeinKwarabutdueto national engagements, he could not. He, however, asked the Vice President to representhim. He,too,couldnotmakeit. OnthedayhewassupposedtobeinOgun, he was somewhere else. So, it is not true that President Buhari is not supporting Asiwaju. The President alongsideTinubu andOgbonayaOnuandsomeotherpeople gavebirthtotheAPC. Hewillneverwork againsttheAPC. He may not go out of his way to help us like other presidents do, riggingelectionsfortheirparty,hemaynot liftafingertogiveanadvantage,buthewill never, never work against us. It is those elements that are doing these things and responsibilityistogovernthecountry But when he is with us, he endorses our candidate; he praises Asiwaju and the relationshipbetweenthemisexcellent. Some polls have put the candidate of the Labour Party ahead of yours. How do you seethis?

Iaminlovewithdataanalysis. WhenIwas a student at the Kennedy School of Government, I was a teaching assistant on statistics The most important thing in looking at any opinion poll is the sample, followedbyyourmethodology Whenyou have about 100 million registered voters and you are sampling 2,000 registered voters,Iamsorry,yourresultsfromdayone are unreliable You will have a wide margin of errors. And most of those polls arelikethat.

What about methodology? Most of these polls, like the Bloomberg, the ANAP, the Okonjo-Iweala, all used telephones. How manyregisteredvotershavetheirtelephone onINEC'srecord?Itisjust31percent. So, from the beginning, your results are dead onarrival.Icantakeeachofthesepollsand deconstruct them This is because I understand their sampling and methodology So,withthegreatestrespect, thosepollsareajoke.

Wehavedoneapollwithasampleofnearly 40,000acrossNigeriaandtheresultshows thatweareahead.Yes,theelectionisgoing to be a tight one There is a large percentage of undecided. So, we must work hard to swing the undecided to our side,butweareahead.

HowcanPeterObi,whoispollingoneper centinSokoto,twopercentinKatsina,five percentinKano,wintheelection?Thefact that you are doing 70 per cent inAnambra state does not mean that somebody doing 10 per cent in Kano is not better than you. Kanohasfourmillionvotes.Thenumberof votersinAnambraisonelocalgovernment inKadunaState.Yes,PeterObiwillsweep South-eastern states; he will do well in South-South,whereelse?Hewon'tdowell intheSouthwest. Heispollingwellinthe Christian enclave in the North. But how many are they? Obi cannot win this election. He does not have the number of states. He does not have the 25 per cent spread. PeterObiisaNollywoodactorand thatiswherehewillbe.

This election is between the APC and the PDP because they have the spread Ethnicityandreligiousbigotrywillnottake you anywhere and those are what the LabourParty'scampaignsareabout.Weare theonlypartywithabroadbaseofsupport acrossNigeriaandbythegraceofGod,we aregoingtowin.