INTERVIEW
“IT IS MY WORK TO DEFEND PEOPLE, NO MATTER WHO THEY ARE, NO MATTER WHAT THEY ARE, NO MATTER WHAT THEY DID”
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Foto door Peter Beijen
November 2019 | ALIBI Magazine
INTERVIEW
IN GESPREK MET MICHEL TOGUÉ LISA LANGENDIJK & MIRTE MILTENBURG Michel Togué is one of the only two lawyers in Cameroon defending LGBT rights. That is not because lawyers defending LGBT rights are superfluous in Cameroon. In fact, based on the Cameroon Penal Code, anyone who has sex with a person of the same gender will be punished with imprisonment of six months to five years and a fine of 20.000 to 200.000 francs.1 Homosexuality is such a taboo in Cameroon that many lawyers are unwilling to defend people prosecuted based on this provision and lawyers who do represent LGBT people are faced with serious consequences of their work. Both Michel Togué and his colleague Alice Nkom received numerous death threats and Togué’s family was even forced to flee the country. Despite this, he is far from giving up his fight and remains positive that one day his dream will come true: a world where everyone is treated equally, no matter sexuality, gender, color or religion.2
chamber who asked me to defend one his friends, a young journalist who was in jail because his homosexuality. It was the first time that I ever had such a request and, in first instance, I thought about declining the case. Then however, there was something from the bottom of my heart saying: “You are a lawyer, you cannot discriminate, you cannot stigmatize someone. It is your work to defend people, no matter who they are, no matter what they are, no matter what they did.” So I accepted the case and I managed to get him released after being in prison for 7 months without any sort of sentence. From that time on, I decided to assist LGBT people. Back then, I had no idea that this would cause me so many problems, threats and would even put my life on the line.”
When and why did you start defending
Have the threats ever made you consider quitting defending LGBT people? “No, because I have a strong personal conviction that sex is part of your private
LGBT rights? “I have been a lawyer in Cameroon since 22 years and I have been representing LGBT people since 15 or 16 years now. One day I received someone in my
life. That is why I never want to give up on this work. I do this job because I belief that I am on the right path. When people are having sex, is that your business? Should it be anyone’s business? Does
November 2019 | ALIBI Magazine
“YOU CANNOT JUST TRY TO PRACTICE LAW WITHOUT TAKING INTO ACCOUNT THE HUMAN BEING BEHIND IT”
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INTERVIEW
it cause any damages? No. I could have stayed with my family in the United States and live my American life, but I decided to go back, because I belief this is a fight I should win; no matter the time it takes.” How does your family feel about you continuing your work? “My wife and children are my biggest supporters. They are my fans. I am extremely proud of that, actually. My work has had a positive influence on them. I had the possibility to educate them about LGBT rights and about what I am fighting for, so now they understand better why I am fighting for this.” Which case had the biggest impact on you? Why? “I remember the case of two very young boys who were arrested by the police, just because they were dressed as women. The article in the Cameroon Penal Code states that sexual reports (rapports sexuelles, red.) are punished. But the cases are not about people who have been caught having sex. To arrest people for that, you would have to breach their privacy, so they find other ways to ‘catch’ LGBT people. They get arrested solely based on their behavior. On what they wear, how they act, even on what they drink. There was a case of a young man, sentenced to 5 years in prison for drinking Baileys in a nightclub because it is considered to be a ‘feminine drink’. To sentence someone to prison for that is total rubbish.” Do you think that the controversial article, prohibiting any sexual activity between people of the same sex, will be repealed? “This is the main point, this provision. When our country had the Universal Periodic Review, many countries recommended Cameroon to legalize homosexuality. Unfortunately, at that
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time the government decided to let the parliament vote for a new law stating that homosexuality is an offense. First of all, we have to make sure that this provision is repealed from our legal system. After that, we will have to work on people’s minds. We will have to explain to them what LGBT rights are, what they stand for, and that they should be considered as basic human rights. Right now, the cultural and religious belief in Cameroon is still that having sex with a person of the same gender is a sin. People think that it is just Western behavior that it does not exist in Cameroon. That is simply not true. It is not the West who ‘made’ LGBT people the way they are.” Do you think that in cases where people are sentenced to imprisonment based on a very marginal amount of proof is a result of homophobia among Cameroonian judges? “That depends. There are very conservative judges, who still feel like homosexuality is a sin. On the other hand, there are also judges who are leaning more towards an attitude with a bigger emphasis on human rights. In those cases, LGBT people are more likely to get a fair trial. Judges are part of the society. There is not one sentiment amongst them. That makes our work harder for us. Many judges did not have an adequate education about LGBT rights, which makes them less tolerant on these issues.” Did your work for LGBT rights affect the other work that you do? “Five years ago, I lost some of my clients because they identified me with my LGBT clients and assumed that I was engaging in gay activities. The current situation is not the same anymore. People are beginning to understand that being a lawyer is about defending your client, no matter religious belief
or personal conviction. Even in LGBT cases, an open-minded judge will apply the law as it is. Also in other cases, in the end, it will depend on what the judge thinks of me and how I am defending my clients.” Do you feel like you are getting more support from other lawyers? “No, we actually receive a lot of resistance and there are not many of us. Not many lawyers are willing to fight for LGBT rights. One of the main reasons for that is that there is not a big compensation for the work we do. Most cases are pro bono. The people that we are defending are generally poor. They do not have the means to pay much for their defense. This also means that they are very vulnerable.” How can the legal profession further improve the situation for the LGBT community in Cameroon? “Just the fact that LGBT people are aware that they have rights and that there are people who will defend them is very important. It gives them courage
“PEOPLE GET ARRESTED SOLELY BASED ON THEIR BEHAVIOR. ON WHAT THEY WEAR, HOW THEY ACT, EVEN ON WHAT THEY DRINK”
November 2019 | ALIBI Magazine
INTERVIEW
to be who they are and to know that not everyone is against them. However, right now, in Cameroon, even certain human rights lawyers do not recognize LGBT rights. Can you imagine that people call themselves human rights defenders, whilst being against LGBT rights, because they believe that these rights are not included in the spectrum of human rights? To me, that does not make any sense. In order to get more young lawyers defending LGBT people, I started a project to interest younger law students in LGBT rights and building their own capacity and knowledge about LGBT rights. If we are able to build capacity on the subject, I think the situation will improve a little bit.” Over the past years, there have been LGBT movements all over the world, such as the several Gay Prides and other demonstrations. Do you think that this global movement has any positive influence on the younger generation in Cameroon, and the way they see LGBT rights? “No, I do not see that at all. Every august 21, there is a demonstration against LGBT rights which is organized by a young leader. I am not sure that younger people will change their mind just because we have the social networks and the Internet. However, there is a big change as to the ability to even talk about this subject. Only six years ago, homosexuality was a total taboo; no one was even talking about it. Now when it comes up, people are discussing it. People are talking about it more. But in general, most people are still very ignorant on this subject. It is not easy. Nevertheless, every single time you talk to someone about LGBT rights, educate them, you change their minds, even if just a little bit. If younger people would be educated adequately on human rights it would completely change their behavior.”
November 2019 | ALIBI Magazine
What has receiving the Geuzenpenning award done for you? “It was a big recognition for me. Every acknowledgement is some kind of petrol that you put in your engine, some kind of fuel. This award in particular was kind of a huge recognition for me, for the work I have been doing. I had never met those people in my life. I do not know how they chose us. But it was huge for me, for our work. In this line of work, the higher your profile, the less vulnerable you are. If you are recognized internationally, that means a lot locally. It makes you less vulnerable: people will know that there is an international community watching.” What do you see as the biggest achievement in your career? And what would you like to achieve in the future? “I am very proud of this fight. Six years ago, homosexuality was a total taboo. Today, the subject is on the table. There are many people still against LGBT rights, but at least the discussion is there. My dream would be to have a Cameroon pride. People walking around, openly demonstrating to express themselves and their LGBT rights. People are stigmatized. How can we, as human beings, not have a peaceful look at one another? No matter skin color, no matter gender, no matter behavior or the way someone walks, for me, we all have the same color of blood in our veins. We should treat other people in a peaceful way; whether you are white, black, yellow, green, our blood is the same. This is an everlasting truth for everybody. There is a question is the signature of my email that states: “What can be our input to make this life easer?”
That we act in line with the answer to this question, to treat all people that way, that is my dream.” As a last question, what advice would you want to give to law students reading Alibi? “I’m thinking about discrimination. Not only LGBT people are discriminated. Everywhere in the world, people are being discriminated. Make sure to avoid discrimination in your life. Also, for law students, I want them to know that the law exists because people are subject to the law. You cannot just try to practice law without taking into account the human being behind it. It should be a condition for them to take the human aspect into account, every single time making a decision, as a lawyer, a judge or anything else. Try to see the humanity in the law.”•
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Article 347-1 of the Cameroon Panel Code: “Est punie d’un emprisonnement de six (06) mois à cinq (05) ans et d’une amende de vingt mille (20 000) à deux cent mille (200 000) francs, toute personne qui a des rapports sexuels avec une personne de son sexe.” This can be translated as: “Punished with imprisonment of six months to five years and a fine of 20.000 to 200.000 francs, will be anyone who has sex with a person of the same gender.” In this interview, the term LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender) is used to describe the community of people that express sexual or gender identities that differ from male/female heterosexual.
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